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Thread: Fiery Imposition cropping incorrectly

  1. #1
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    Default Fiery Imposition cropping incorrectly

    Before I highlight the problem I’ll just give a run down of my workflow –

    Printing on Mac OSX either from InDesign CC or Acrobat Pro/Reader to our RIP/Xerox Hold Queue.
    Sent to the RIP for example is an A4 document 1-up on a larger sheet (A3) to allow for trim marks and bleed.

    The command workstation 5.7.0.29 is used to impose, using Fiery Impose, to set 2-up.

    In Fiery Impose “Finish Size” is set as “User defined” and manually set as 210mm x 297mm.

    As we know, this effectively crops to 210mm x 297mm from the outside inward toward the centre, cropping the larger A3 original document.

    This is where the problem occurs. Sometimes the cropping does not occur inward toward the centre, but rather offset to the side. So the image is cropped incorrectly and cannot be imposed.

    I’ve identified the trigger for this behaviour and it’s to do with the page setup in Acrobat/InDesign. The portrait/landscape orientation selection affects whether it occurs, although it has no visible effect on preview in the main print dialog window.

    Our previous Creo Spire RIP didn’t suffer from this problem so I’m wondering why it’s occurring with command workstation.

  2. #2
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    Could you provide information regarding which printer and Fiery model and version you are using?

    Can you also provide more details about the job setup and the settings in the application Print dialog when the issue is seen?

    Finally, in the cases where you see the issue when printing from Acrobat, have you tried importing the PDF in Command WorkStation instead of opening in Acrobat and printing? Impose should recognize the Trim Box of the PDF, if it exists, file when applying User Defined Finish Size.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
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    Thank you Bob.
    Versant VP80, ex-i 80 ver 1.0

    Quick test suggests that importing PDF to command workstation crops for imposition as intended, however I do need a solution for Acrobat/InDesign printing.

    Print driver settings/fiery features are all at defaults.
    See 3 screen grabs below:

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  4. #4
    adam1991 is offline Fiery Forum Expert Contributor adam1991 has proven very helpful adam1991 has proven very helpful adam1991 has proven very helpful adam1991 has proven very helpful adam1991 has proven very helpful
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    OK.

    As near as I can tell, what you're doing is printing the InDesign image onto a larger sheet size. When it gets to the Fiery, all the Fiery knows is "hey, I have an A3 object". You're thinking "no, it's an A4 object plus bleeds"--but that's not how file-print works when you tell it to use an A3 sized surface.

    What you need to do in InDesign is tell InD to print to a custom page size, and to use document bleeds. That will send the correct size document to the Fiery, which you can then impose.

    (Ummm....to be fair, it IS how Creo works--that is, Creo by its very nature RIPs down to the image, no matter what paper size you told it to send. Fiery does NOT do this; it finds the bounding box of the paper size you sent, and that's it. Period.)

  5. #5
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    That's fine Adam, but how does this factor in when selecting "User defined" for the finish size?

    Surely it should just create a crop box centralised on the larger sheet?

    Quote Originally Posted by adam1991 View Post
    What you need to do in InDesign is tell InD to print to a custom page size, and to use document bleeds. That will send the correct size document to the Fiery, which you can then impose.
    It's funny you should mention using "custom size" in InDesign. Doing this can actually create a whole other world of pain. I've printed a entire job that was somehow scaled to approx 95% doing it this way. That's the reason I used a predefined larger page size e.g. A3, SRA3. (To clarify, no, I did NOT use fit-to-page or any other scaling methods.)

    This is a massive issue in itself and really an issue for another thread though.

  6. #6
    adam1991 is offline Fiery Forum Expert Contributor adam1991 has proven very helpful adam1991 has proven very helpful adam1991 has proven very helpful adam1991 has proven very helpful adam1991 has proven very helpful
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    I have no idea what you got into when you got the 95% thing.

    Trust me, printing custom size out of InDesign will have InD send exactly the page size to the printer, nothing more, and no zoom or reduction.

    Telling InD to use document bleed settings quite literally does that: it adds the document bleed settings to what it sends.

    This is how it's been done forever.

    But then some people decided to have wacky page sizes and wacky margins. Some users had offset trim box locations relative to the page. User Defined, then, finds the trim and the bleed wherever it is.

    But when you file-print, you are defining an A3 bounding box. That's the nature of Postscript and the Fiery. User Defined knows only what the Postscript told it: A3.

    If you're going to file-print, the end answer is to use Custom Size and document bleed settings.

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