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Thread: JDF Printing of a large job fails.

  1. #1
    Join Date
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    Default JDF Printing of a large job fails.

    Hi folks, I'm new here and new to Fiery overall. I recently purchased a Konica Minolta bizhub press C70hc. With it I recieved the PRO80 Fiery Printer Controller.

    My primary print job is a 3-ring binder, its 642 pages in size and consists of several hundred small PDF files. I Adobe Acrobat Pro X and utilize its JDF workflow to assemble the files into a job and send it to the printer. Each major section of the binder is seperated by a tab so I've also setup the jdf file to place the tabs in where they need to be so that I get a complete book that I just have to slip into the binder when its complete.

    The problem I'm running into is that no matter what I do, when I submit this job it fails to translate the entire thing into the Fiery for me to set properties and print using Command Workstation (version 5.2.0.62).

    At first I thought it was the number of files so I added an extra set of steps to assemble the individual PDF files into combined section files, then setup a JDF file to combine and send to the printer all the sections with the appropriate tabs inbetween. That job failed as well.

    The only thing I was finally able to do was combine the entire thing into a PDF file and then send that PDF to the printer like it was a common little InkJet printer. I now have to manually count out the page numbers where the tabs need to go which is a huge issue because my engineers are constantly updating and modifying documents adding and subtracting pages from the individual files. Essentially every time I need to print I have to go through and verify all the tab page numbers and manually enter in the mixed media settings. Saving the settings doesn't do me any good.

    I saw some threads about file size limit, the book I'm printing when combined into a Fiery Optimzed PDF is 540mb in size, so we're talking less than 1mb per page.

    Does anyone have any suggestions on how I can get this to work?

  2. #2
    thistlegorm is offline Fiery Forum Expert Contributor thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status
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    Default

    Are you using the EFI JDF Connector Client ( version I loaded was 1.8.1 ) - are you able to export out your JDF xml file from Acrobat ( which version ? ) & post here - I'll have a look & see what my box says.. (Xerox - not KM ) but this is all about Fiery's..
    Remember you are what you eat ! I'm a twix..

  3. #3
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by thistlegorm View Post
    Are you using the EFI JDF Connector Client ( version I loaded was 1.8.1 ) - are you able to export out your JDF xml file from Acrobat ( which version ? ) & post here - I'll have a look & see what my box says.. (Xerox - not KM ) but this is all about Fiery's..
    I am not familiar with the EFI JDF Connector Client, I was just trying to submit straight to the printer from within Adobe Acrobat X Pro.

    All Acrobat lets me pull the JDF file out as is the original .jdf or as a .html file, neither of which this forum will let me attach. Its telling me invalid file format for each.

  4. #4
    thistlegorm is offline Fiery Forum Expert Contributor thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status
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    My understanding of how JDF works ( I could be wrong .. ) was that the EFI RIP itself would not understand a JDF ticket direct ? - hence the connector software which you point to your Fiery Server - once connected it would pull the e.g. stock Library etc.. you can download it from here: http://services.efi.com/support/driv..._jdf&ver=1.8.1

    The Connector then lets you Import JDF / JDF xml into it..

    Give it go & see how you get on - I would be interested to know the results.. ?
    Last edited by thistlegorm; 01-24-2012 at 01:17 PM. Reason: cannot spell..
    Remember you are what you eat ! I'm a twix..

  5. #5
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    Default

    thistlegorm, thanks for the download link. I'm grabbing it now to see what happens. The way my CWS is setup it certainly looks like it should just take the direct input of the JDF, it recognizes it, even understands that I need predefined page types for different sections of the JDF, the problem comes after the paper types are mapped.

    I'm working with my printer's vendor who are going to be talking with EFI directly about this, but I'll definitely keep this thread updated with progress.

  6. #6
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    Default Hey Guys, I'm moving this thread

    Hey guys, as FYI... I am just moving your thread to our dedicated JDF category.

    Thanks,

    Gary

  7. #7
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    Default

    This Fiery includes Fiery JDF which provides built in support for JDF. Fiery JDF Connector would not be needed and would not be supported with this Fiery.

    The first step to set up this type of workflow would be to make sure that Fiery JDF is enabled. This is done in Configure which can be accessed from Command WorkStation if you are logged in as Administrator or from WebTools. Choose JDF from the Server section and check the Enable JDF check box. You can define which queue you want the jobs be sent to under Job Action. Make note of hte JMF URL as this will be the URL you will want to use in the Acrobat JDF Submission Setup. You may want to start with the Hold queue while you are testing.

    The next step would be to define the JDF Job Definition in Acrobat. It is important that the page size assigned to each section match the page size of the Fiery Paper Catalog media that the job will be mapped to. You should also make a media definition in Acrobat that is similar to the Fiery Paper Catalog media definition. One limitation in Acrobat is that it does not allow you to define a set count for tabs.

    When you submit the job to the Fiery, it should show up in the queue you had assigned in Configure. If there is a media mismatch the job will go to the Hold queue with a warning. You can right click the file and choose JDF Settings or click the JDF Settings button in the Job Summary. This will open a window that includes a Media tab where you will see a drop down list of JDF media definitions. If the media has a green check next to it, the Fiery found a corresponding media in it's Paper Catalog that the JDF media could be mapped to. If there is a warning symbol next to the JDF media, the Fiery could not find a corresponding media and the Map to Paper Catalog drop down list will display "Not Mapped".

    For media that is not mapped, you can choose a Paper Catalog media that you want to map to or you can add the JDF media to the Fiery Paper Catalog. If you add your JDF tab media definition to the Fiery Paper Catalog, you will have to edit the Fiery Paper Catalog entry to add the set count. Because Paper Catalog media cannot be changed if there is a job using that media, you will have to delete your JDF job before editing. You can avoid this if you simply map to an existing tab media. Make sure that all JDF media is mapped to Fiery Paper Catalog media before closing JDF Settings.

    In my tests with Acrobat, I found that if I completed the mapping with one job and then used the same media and paper size settings on a second job, the media would be automatically mapped when job two was submitted. I would suggest making a few small test files at the beginning to simplify the media mapping.

    I hope this helps. If you still have issues, it would help to have a sample JDF file and the corresponding PDF files for evalutation. You should be able to post them if you save them in a Zip archive. You can find more information about Fiery JDF integration at http://w3.efi.com/Fiery/Products/Fie...F%20Technology.

    Bob

  8. #8
    thistlegorm is offline Fiery Forum Expert Contributor thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status
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    Default

    Bob , Gary -

    Just shows what you can glean by scrolling down the screen... good info

    Apologies - Mthies, one of the issues with a forum that covers multiple vendors is that you utilise your own experiences & then see whether they fit within another vendors RIP - in this case, I was wrong still hopefully Bobs info will fix your issue -
    Remember you are what you eat ! I'm a twix..

  9. #9
    Join Date
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    Default Radical, new and easier approach to JDF with a PDF workflow

    I personally know a developer with a working product that allows you to do JDF with conditional logic, in a PDF workflow. I tested it on Canon devices. It works with Fiery and non-Fiery RIPs, and every major manufacturer's hardware. It supports media calls, imposition, group for print, subset finishing, etc. You can set up workflows with hot folders, or simply browse to your pdf file(s) and use these parameters to create your variable print exceptions:

    Set up print exceptions based on individual file names. xxx.pdf prints from tray 3 and is stapled separately. yyy.pdf prints from tray 4 and is imposed 4-up, zzz.pdf prints from tray 1, etc. Create rules for print order, tray calls, etc. then make a hot folder and dump them in.
    Set up print exceptions based on text string. Swipe text anywhere on the page to create JDF. Perfect for variable length jobs with recurring format.
    Use X and Y coordinates. "When something is here, do this..." call paper, print options, finishing; perfect for template recognition.

    Another nice thing is, the files go down to the Fiery as indiv. files, not one monstrous PDF. This solves problems including using too much RIP memory, and also you have control over which file prints in which order. Sometimes, with certain variable data solutions, files process out of order because of the ease with which the solution can parse them. Small files with only 1 step in the workflow print before a large file with a complex workflow, even though the large file was submitted into the hot folder first.

    If this sounds like something you can use, let me know. This company has the best value proposition I have ever seen - no pro services fees. If customization of the solution is needed, they include that with the purchase. Also, they don't sell it unless you have a 100% successful trial, with your data and hardware.

    If you are tired of promises to simplify your job ticketing in a production environment that have not lived up to your expectations, reply to this post and let me know.

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