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Thread: Degradation in color when imposing in XC1000 with Fiery EX1000

  1. #1
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    Unhappy Degradation in color when imposing in XC1000 with Fiery EX1000

    Hi,
    i have one issue with Fiery XC1000, when we impose a file and gangup it then many, we can see degradation in print quality (printing direction and not indoard outboard).
    for information we have:
    Acrobat 9.1
    System 9 R2 version 1.3
    the system is updated

    could someone please help!!!!

    Many thakns
    Fouad

  2. #2
    thistlegorm is offline Fiery Forum Expert Contributor thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status
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    Hi Fouad,

    First things first - are you absolutely sure that this is a Fiery issue ? does this happen on a particular stock or all stocks ? on the PCUI if you open up Stock Management & run the Transfer tool are you getting solid coverage on the that stock @ 100% ? assuming all the Stocks Check out - if you import a stock job on the Fiery ( E:\EFI\Server\User Documentation ) & use the same workflow do you see the same issue ? another trick is on your file right click on the file & Process & Hold then view the job in Imageviewer this will give you the Ripped view prior to output - is the defect visible in there ? also you haven't mentioned what sort of job it is or how it is made up or what the defect is ? for example if you print the job on the same stock without Imposition do you see the same issue ? if the file is a pdf have you tried importing the file or dropping onto a hotfolder or drag & dropping onto CWS loaded on a client & then using the APPE ( Adobe Postscript Print Engine ) & printing the Job with this enabled ? do you still see the same issue..

    Sorry not many fixes - but a lot to try.. let us know..
    Remember you are what you eat ! I'm a twix..

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    Hi,

    Thank you for your answer.
    We have run many tests to try to figure out where the problem is :
    first test : we have imposed the file on the fiery , and saved it as pdf file and printed on antoher digital press , the result was the same ," color shift" . on the duplicted images .
    second test : We have imposed manually the file by ilustrator , and printed on the digtal press CP1000 . the result . Perfect and no color shift .
    3rd Test : we imposed on the Fiery of two different digital press : ( DC 5000 and X700 ) , and problem is the same , color shift.
    attached original file, imposed, printed on .
    Thank you for your support
    Fouad
    Attached Images    
    Attached Images

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    I'm not sure what you are referring to by "color shift" from looking at the files you attached. After looking at them, I can see an issue with overprint. When you use "Output Preview" (only in Acrobat Pro) and have Simulate Overprint turned on, all the area that is white, becomes filled with colour. I'm guessing this is the issue you're referring to? If that's the case, you can likely solve this by checking "Composite Overprint" in the job properties, under Color. I've had this very problem happen on many customer supplied files, and this is the solution. Try it out, from the file you attached here, I'm guessing that's the issue.
    Currently using CWS 5.3.1.32 on Windows 7 Ultimate x64 SP1.

    Running 3 Ricoh machines:
    Pro C900 - ProC900 v4.0 System 8 Release 2 (PLP Installed)
    Pro 1107ex - EB-1357ex v1.1 System 8 Release 2
    Aficio 3260 - E7000 v1.2 System 6e.

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    Hi Mark,

    Thanks for your answer.
    unfortunentely its not the issue, the issue you can see it on the duplicated image.
    as you can see, the duplicated image (down) is too dark than the original (up).

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    thistlegorm is offline Fiery Forum Expert Contributor thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status
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    Hi Fouad,

    Are you importing the PDF to the CP1000 & then Imposing ? or are you printing the PDF then Imposing the PS ? I ask, as when you Impose there is a conversion from your Postscript to PDF through Distiller & the Fiery Optimised 2. Although this is set to leave colours unchanged it does have a convert to smooth shade selected I wondered whether this was doing anything to the shading ? Also if you were to take your Illustrator Imposed file & Process & Hold then open in Imageviewer this will give you the ripped view - you can then use the colour picker & take a few readings - then repeat with the Fiery Imposed file & compare the same spots - do you get the same readings ? from looking at your Imposed file to the un-Imposed file you supplied in Acrobat Pro with the eye dropper the Macdonalds M CMYK values do not change but the Gradation on the background does..
    Another thing you might want to try is on the Fiery Imposed Job in the colour tab & Basic Settings - turn the CMYK simulation profile to none then Process & Hold & repeat the above - does it improve / get worse ? it's obviously something in the Fiery Imposition process that is changing the Shading - just a case of trying to narrow down what...

    If I get a chance today - I'll swing by one of my customers with a CP1000 & try the same & see what I get..
    Last edited by thistlegorm; 11-03-2011 at 10:58 PM.
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    Hi Fouad,

    Ignore my last post - I've just used your Non Impose pdf & Imported into a EX1000 V 1.3 2up on SRA3 Repeat - Duplex - When you look at the Output as a single sheet of SRA3 it looks exactly as your scan & the bottom looks darker than the top.. however if you cut the sheets to size & lay them down on each other they are exactly the same - this is confirmed when you Process & Hold the .dbp file & view the colours... is it possible that this is an optical illusion ?? I am just in the process of upgrading this one so I'll archive the file & pop on the forum when I've finished..
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    manyfaces is offline Senior Fiery Forum Contributor manyfaces is on a distinguished path
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    Hehe, if Fouad hadn't stated that imposing manually in Illustrator was fine, I would have jumped on the Optical Illusion bandwagon days ago. Gradients like this always cause people's eyes to get confused when looking at a multiple-up presssheet.

    I'm curious what ImageViewer shows in the pre and post imposed rasters. Rather than looking at scans of printed pieces, break out the eyedropper tool and see how different the colors actually are.

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    thistlegorm is offline Fiery Forum Expert Contributor thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status thistlegorm has achieved rock star status
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    Her you go Fouad - I've attached an archive of my .dbp file - it's set out as per previous post - if you priint it out on SRA3 you'll get exactly what you have been seeing if you cut into the 2 A4 images then fold the bottom one in half & then lay on top of the top one you'll see they are exactly the same ? mine even had the banding lining up..

    Anyway see what you think..
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